From nomic-official-owner@teleport.com Fri Dec 8 10:20:33 1995 Received: from belize.ucs.indiana.edu (belize.ucs.indiana.edu [129.79.1.64]) by copper.ucs.indiana.edu (8.6.11/8.6.11) with ESMTP id KAA17126 for ; Fri, 8 Dec 1995 10:20:32 -0500 Received: from desiree.teleport.com (desiree.teleport.com [192.108.254.21]) by belize.ucs.indiana.edu (8.7/8.7/1.10IUPO) with SMTP id KAA22693 for ; Fri, 8 Dec 1995 10:18:42 -0500 (EST) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by desiree.teleport.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id FAA04635 for nomic-official-outgoing; Fri, 8 Dec 1995 05:58:11 -0800 Received: from wing4.wing.rug.nl (wing4.wing.rug.nl [129.125.21.4]) by desiree.teleport.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id FAA04613 for ; Fri, 8 Dec 1995 05:58:07 -0800 Message-Id: <199512081358.FAA04613@desiree.teleport.com> Received: by wing4.wing.rug.nl (1.37.109.8/16.2) id AA14639; Fri, 8 Dec 1995 14:56:02 +0100 From: Andre Engels Subject: OFF: CFJ 836 Judgement: TRUE To: nomic-official@teleport.com Date: Fri, 8 Dec 95 14:56:02 MET Mailer: Elm [revision: 70.85] Sender: owner-nomic-official@teleport.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: nomic-discussion@teleport.com Status: RO ====================================================================== ASSIGNMENT CFJ 836 An Organization's Compact cannot specify any method of expanding it's Jurisdiction which is not specifically and explicitly allowed for in the Rules. ====================================================================== Judge: KoJen (defaulted) Oerjan Judgement: TRUE Eligible: Andre, Chuck, Coco, Dave Bowen, Ian, Marc, Michael, Morendil, Oerjan, Pascal, Saltwater, Swann, Vanyel, Vlad, Wes, Zefram Not Eligible: Caller: Wes Barred: Kelly, elJefe, Steve On Hold: favor 1005: Defaulted: KoJen Effects: KoJen gains 3 Blots for defaulting on Judgement, and is not anymore eligible to be selected as a Judge until e requests to be eligible again. Oerjan gains 5 Points for speedy Judgement ====================================================================== History: Called by Kelly, 18 November 1995, timestamp lost Assigned to KoJen, 21 November 1995, 11:59 MET Defaulted by KoJen, 28 November 1995, 11:59 MET Assigned to Oerjan, 1 December 1995, 9:47 MET Judged TRUE by Oerjan, 1 December 1995, timestamp lost ====================================================================== Barred: We would like to Bar any Player who was declared (whether successfully or not) as part of the Triumvirate during the Mousetrap Scam. (Note that Rule 869/2 makes this a valid method to identify a Player, as it is unambiguous; we're just not sure who those three Players were...) ====================================================================== Arguments: A Compact cannot require any actions of someone outside it's Jurisdiction. Therefore, since any prospective Player is by definition outside the Compact's Jurisdiction, the Compact cannot cause (or coerce) that Player to be included within it's Jurisdiction. ====================================================================== Decision & Reasoning Judge: I judge TRUE. I take this to be a statement about general principles, rather than restricted to the particular Classes of Organizations currently defined. (In the latter case, it might very well be that all the Classes have highly restricted methods of expansion. I will not go further into that.) The caller's arguments are consistent with this. Wes's arguments are somewhat, but not fatally faulty. He notes "A Compact cannot require any actions of someone outside it's Jurisdiction." I do not find that this alone is enough for his conclusion to hold. Specifically, I do not believe that the (forced) inclusion of a Player into a jurisdiction counts as an action by that Player. However, I find that it does count as a requirement, and so Rule 1530 still applies. Yours logically, Oerjan. ====================================================================== Evidence: Rule 1529 (excerpt) Rule 1530 (excerpt) "Statutes: ... must be obeyed by Players within the Compact's Jurisdiction..." [Rule 1529/0] "A Compact has no force to require, or oblige, anything of Players who are not within its Jurisdiction... This Rule takes precedence over any other Rule governing Compacts." [Rule 1530/0]