>From nomic-official-owner@teleport.com Tue Aug 8 22:13:06 1995 Received: from desiree.teleport.com (desiree.teleport.com [192.108.254.11]) by Shamino.quincy.edu (8.6.12/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA01773 for ; Tue, 8 Aug 1995 22:13:04 -0500 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by desiree.teleport.com (8.6.10/8.6.9) id TAA25753 for nomic-official-outgoing; Tue, 8 Aug 1995 19:10:16 -0700 Received: from timbuk.cray.com (root@timbuk.cray.com [128.162.19.7]) by desiree.teleport.com (8.6.10/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA25733 for ; Tue, 8 Aug 1995 19:10:04 -0700 Received: from sdiv.cray.com (root@ironwood-fddi.cray.com [128.162.21.36]) by timbuk.cray.com (8.6.12/CRI-8-1.16) with SMTP id VAA21231 for ; Tue, 8 Aug 1995 21:07:53 -0500 Received: from birch111 by sdiv.cray.com (5.x/CRI-5.15.b.orgabbr Sdiv) id AA07730; Tue, 8 Aug 1995 20:15:07 -0500 Message-Id: <9508090115.AA07730@sdiv.cray.com> To: nomic-official@teleport.com Subject: OFF: Decision on CFJ 801 Date: Tue, 08 Aug 1995 20:15:06 -0500 >From: David Bowen Sender: owner-nomic-official@teleport.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: nomic-discussion@teleport.com Status: RO ============================================================ CFJ 801 Caller: TAL Statement: The Confidentiality of Contracts Rule 1459, shall be interpreted such that a Judge or a Justice has the possibility to ask the Notary to disclose *all* contracts that fulfill certain conditions. Barred: Vlad Requested Injunction: none Judge: Steve Judgement: TRUE Effects reported by COTC (* indicates new to this report): *Steve receives 3 points for judgement. ============================================================ ============================================================ History: Called by TAL Thu, 03 Aug 95 10:18:04 SET Assigned to Steve Thu, 3 Aug 95 04:53:27 CDT Judged TRUE by Steve Tue, 8 Aug 1995 10:27:44 +1000 Judgement published {with this report} ============================================================ Arguments of Caller (TAL): The unique purpose of this CFJ is to expose which Players made a Contract with Vlad concerning the latter's Proposal 1661. To do this I use a loophole I think exists in Rule 1459. In fact the Rule states: " However, the following disclosures are legal, as noted: [...] * Disclosure of part or all of any Contract, to a Judge or Justice who believes that knowledge of the contents of the Contract is necessary for em to Judge a CFJ." This of course, leaves it in the hands of the Judge to decide which Contracts e might need, without *any* check or penalty for abuse. So much for the truthfullness of my statement. If the Judge agrees with me, I appeal to the Judge to use this unlimited power to ask the Notary for *all* Contracts that fulfill the following condition: Vlad is one party of the Contract and the number `1661' appears in the Contract. By Rule 1459 the Judge is not allowed to add these Contracts to the Judgment, but nothing forbids the Judge to publish a list of Players that entered such Contracts. :-) ============================================================ Evidence provided by Caller (TAL): Rule 1459/0 (Mutable, MI=1) Confidentiality of Contracts A Player who is or has been Notary may not divulge any part of any Contract which was entered into or was in force during the time that e is or was Notary. However, the following disclosures are legal, as noted: * Disclosure of part or all of a Contract, to any party of that Contract; * Disclosure of part or all of any Contract, to the current Notary; * Disclosure of part or all of any Contract, to a Judge or Justice who believes that knowledge of the contents of the Contract is necessary for em to Judge a CFJ. If a Judge or Justice requires disclosure of a Contract to em for the purpose of Judging a CFJ, the Notary is required to provide a copy of the Contract to the Judge or Justice as soon as possible after the Judge's or Justice's request. The Judge or Justice receiving the contract is then bound by the same strictures of nondisclosure as is the Notary, and is further prohibited from attaching a copy of it to eir Judgement as evidence. This Rule takes precedence over any Rule which would require the Notary to provide such records upon request, and which would require a Judge to include a copy of a Contract as part of the evidence justifying eir Ruling. In addition, this Rule shall never be construed such that a Player may not disclose part of all of any Contract of which e is a party. ============================================================ Arguments of Judge Steve I Judge that the Statement is TRUE. In fact, it seems trivially true to me. At first glance, it seems made true by the clause in Rule 1459 that allows a Judge or Justice access to any Contracts if e "believes that knowledge of the contents of the Contract is necessary for em to Judge a CFJ." But in fact, even were this or any similar such clause absent from Rule 1459, the CFJ would still be true. This is because Rule 1459 places restrictions only on what the Notary may divulge, *not* on what a Judge or Justice may ask the Notary to divulge. As far as the Rules are concerned, a Judge or Justice (or indeed any Player) may ask the Notary for information concerning any Contracts whatsoever, even Contracts the contents of which it would be illegal for the Notary to divulge. Responsibility for compliance with Rule 1459 lies entirely with the Notary, and e must determine for emself what limits e regards Rule 1459 as placing on em. As for TAL's purpose in calling the CFJ, I'm afraid that it has not been met. Although, given the above, it would be perfectly legal for me to ask the Notary to divulge the contents of all the Contracts concerning Proposal 1661 to which Vlad is party, I also believe that it would be illegal for the Notary to provide me with this information, since it is evident that I do not believe that knowledge of the contents of these Contracts is necessary for me to Judge the CFJ. Indeed, it is evident from the above that I have been able to reach the Judgement that the CFJ is TRUE entirely without the need to see any specific Contracts at all. Nice try, TAL, but no cigar - this time. ============================================================ End of CFJ 801 ============================================================