From nomic-official-owner@teleport.com Sun Mar 12 18:34:46 1995 Return-Path: nomic-official-owner@teleport.com Received: from desiree.teleport.com (desiree.teleport.com [192.108.254.11]) by Shamino.quincy.edu (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA27607; Sun, 12 Mar 1995 18:34:44 -0600 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by desiree.teleport.com (8.6.10/8.6.9) id QAA05702 for nomic-official-outgoing; Sun, 12 Mar 1995 16:40:15 -0800 Received: from mizar.astro.indiana.edu (mizar.astro.indiana.edu [129.79.160.43]) by desiree.teleport.com (8.6.10/8.6.9) with SMTP id QAA05661 for ; Sun, 12 Mar 1995 16:40:05 -0800 Received: from poverty by mizar.astro.indiana.edu with uucp (Smail3.1.28.1 #7) id m0rnyB0-0001RfC; Sun, 12 Mar 95 19:40 EST Received: by poverty.bloomington.in.us (V1.17-beta/Amiga) id <2bd2@poverty.bloomington.in.us>; Sun, 12 Mar 95 19:35:16 EST5 Date: Sun, 12 Mar 95 19:35:16 EST5 Message-Id: <9503130035.2bd2@poverty.bloomington.in.us> From: kelly@poverty.bloomington.in.us (Kelly Martin) To: nomic-official@teleport.com Subject: OFF: Judgement of CFJ 751 (Rule 1438 can only be interpretated...) Sender: owner-nomic-official@teleport.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: nomic-discussion@teleport.com Status: RO ====================================================================== JUDGEMENT OF CFJ 751 (Rule 1438 can only be interpretated...) ====================================================================== Date: 13 Mar 1995 00:35 UTC Judgement: FALSE Judge: Steve Eligible to Judge: Andre, Blob, Coren, Dave, Elde, Einstein, elJefe, Jeffrey, JonRock, Kelly, KoJen, Michael, Oerjan, Pascal, Steve, Vlad Caller: TAL Barred: Swann, Vanyel, Chuck Scorekeepor: Steve receives 3 Points for timely Judgement ---------------------------------------------------------------------- History: Called Thu, 09 Mar 95 18:06:52 WET by TAL Assigned Thu, 09 Mar 1995 22:15 UTC to Steve Judged TRUE Mon, 13 Mar 1995 11:08:08 +1100 (EST) by Steve --> Steve receives 3 Points ====================================================================== Statement: "Rule 1438 can only be interpretated in such a way, that no Rule can lead to a Punitive Point Loss" Players barred: Swann, Vanyel, Chuck ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Arguments: Note: if Judged TRUE the Judge has the right to issue an Injonction, to annotate Rule 1438. Rule 1438 defines a Punitive Point Loss (PPL) in a negative way: "Punitive Point Losses are those losses *not* due to:, etc." One of the excluded losses is " vii) Rules that also adjust the number of Blots a Player has." Now suppose that a Rule X imposes a point loss on a Player and that such a loss is not already covered by one of the other exceptions. By 1438 that Player will then "...receive Blots equal to half the number of Points lost, rounded down." Hence Rule X will in that case lead to an adjustment in the number of Points a Player has. But in that case Rule X falls under the exclusion clause vii) quoted above. Consequently, that loss can not be a PPL. Quod Erat Demonstrandum. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- References: Rule 1438/0 (Mutable, MI=1) Blots Due to a Punititve Point Loss A Punitive Point Loss is a point loss that results in gaining Blots. Whenever a Rule calls for a Punitive Point loss, the Player losing Points will receive Blots equal to half the number of Points lost, rounded down. Punitive Point Losses are those losses *not* due to: i) Voluntary transfers of Points to any other Player or any other Nomic Entity. ii) Voluntary destruction of a Player's own Points. iii) The outcome of a Vote on a Proposal iv) Adjustments made as part of a correction in the Game State. v) The reset of scores due to the end of a Game. vi) A score change that a Rule specifically designates as Non-Punitive. vii) Rules that also adjust the number of Blots a Player has. Further, a Point Loss ceases to be Punitive when the Rule mandating the Loss is amended to explicitly state either of the following: i) The Rule does not impose a Blot penalty. ii) The Rule does impose a Blot penalty, the amount of the Blot penalty, and the Player responsible for reporting those Blots to the Tabulator. Players Legally Responsible for reporting Punitive Point losses to the Scorekeepor also have the Legal Responsibility to report Blots due to those Punitive Point losses to the Tabulator. This Rule shall remain in effect until there are no longer any Punitive Point Losses defined in the Ruleset, at which point this Rule will repeal itself. History: Created by Proposal 1459, Mar. 1 1995 ====================================================================== Judgment: FALSE TAL makes a simple mistake in his argument, by neglecting to note the force of the word "also" in clause (vii) in Rule 1438. This clause states that "Punitive Point Losses are those losses *not* due to ... (vii) Rules which *also* adjust the number of Blots a Player has." TAL's argument is that Rule 1438 itself falls under this description. But this is not so; while Rule 1438 does adjust the Blots of Players, it does not itself authorize any Punitive Point Losses. Hence it it is not a Rule of the type specified in clause (vii). ====================================================================== -- kelly martin Usenet is like a herd of performing elephants with diarrhea--massive, difficult to redirect, awe-inspiring, entertaining, and a source of mind-boggling amounts of excrement when you least expect it. --Gene Spafford, 1992